MARY LOUISE KELLY, HOST:
President Donald Trump continues to call Russian meddling in the 2016 presidential election a hoax. But one person wants to give Trump a reality check on that. That would be Reality Winner. She is the former NSA contractor-turned-whistleblower. She gave the media a top-secret report showing that Russia attempted to interfere in the 2016 presidential election. Winner went to prison for that leak. Texas Public Radio's David Martin Davies sat down with Winner to discuss her new book.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "REALITY")
UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: (As character) We have a search warrant for your house.
SYDNEY SWEENEY: (As Reality Winner) OK.
DAVID MARTIN DAVIES, BYLINE: Reality Winner's story has already been told. There have been two feature films. This is from the 2023 movie "Reality," starring Sydney Sweeney.
(SOUNDBITE OF FILM, "REALITY")
UNIDENTIFIED ACTOR: (As character) This is about possible mishandling of classified information.
SWEENEY: (As Reality Winner) Oh, my goodness. OK.
DAVIES: There is also a Reality Winner documentary, a Broadway play. She was featured on This American Life and lots of news media all telling the story of the south Texan. And from this, Winner has made exactly zero dollars.
REALITY WINNER: I am prohibited from profiting from anything with my name or my story.
DAVIES: Same with her new book. She doesn't even get free copies.
WINNER: I have to buy my own book.
DAVIES: So if the book "Reality Winner: I Am Not Your Enemy" (ph) is not a cash grab, then why write it?
WINNER: There were still questions in that - my story, my life and my personality and the reason why I do what I do.
(SOUNDBITE OF DOGS BARKING)
UNIDENTIFIED PERSON: How are you doing?
WINNER: Good. How are you?
UNIDENTIFIED PERSON: Hey - well...
WINNER: That's fine.
UNIDENTIFIED PERSON: ...I got dog slobber.
DAVIES: I met Winner and her eight dogs at her home on the dusky outskirts of Kingsville, Texas. Four of the dogs are permanent and four are rescue strays. The house belongs to Winner's mom, and on the wall there is a mounted buffalo head. Winner said she rescued it from a dumpster. To spare listeners constant barking in the background, we went to Winner's second home, the CrossFit gym where she coaches.
WINNER: Well, we have our medicine balls, kettlebells and dumbbells all back here. I applied at Walmart and I never heard anything back. I don't know if it's because of my name or, you know, checking that box for criminal background. It's just a blessing being able to at least be a CrossFit coach.
DAVIES: Winner said, in Kingsville, if people recognize her name, it's because they know her family - oh, you must be Brittany's sister. But outside of south Texas, her name has baggage.
WINNER: I get the word traitor a lot. And in a sense that I did take an oath to not disclose that information, I don't a hundred percent disagree with them, even though I did what I did to make this country a better place.
DAVIES: Winner said she doesn't like it when people call her a hero either.
WINNER: You know, I wish it were something more towards the middle of somebody who made a mistake.
DAVIES: In June 2017, Winner was 24 and working as a contractor for the National Security Agency when she printed out a classified report and mailed it to an online news outfit.
WINNER: I never talk about that document.
DAVIES: If she does, she could go back to prison. But it confirmed, with U.S. intelligence evidence, that Russia's military intelligence agency had tried to penetrate America's voting systems. They launched spear phishing attacks on state election offices and even a private voting software company. President Trump continues to call this a Barack Obama-orchestrated hoax.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED RECORDING)
PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: Is they caught President Obama absolutely cold.
DAVIES: Winner says, if it's a hoax...
WINNER: I would love my pardon, then.
DAVIES: Because Winner was arrested under the Espionage Act. She eventually pled guilty and was sentenced to more than five years in prison - the longest sentence ever given for that kind of crime. But both can't be true. Winner can't be guilty of leaking national secrets and, that according to Trump, Russiagate is a hoax.
WINNER: What I leaked is very real, and I should suffer because of it. But at the same time, they can also hurt others by saying it's not real.
DAVIES: Winner is conflicted. She's still worried about the state of the democracy, but she wonders if she should use her name and story to join the protest.
WINNER: You know, I can keep arguing that this is a thing that happened or I can keep my head down and rescue dogs.
DAVIES: Is Winner a traitor or a patriot? Is her story a cautionary tale or inspiring? That depends on your view of reality.
For NPR News, I'm David Martin Davies in Kingsville, Texas. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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